With Ohio gearing up for a referendum vote on SB5, new polling numbers show national support for public unions exceeds that of the Governors who are trying to bust them.

Gallup asked:

With whom do you agree more – governors or state employee unions – in state disputes?

48% of respondents agree with the unions while only 39% agree with the governors. Democrats favor unions at a higher percentage (70%) than Republicans agree with governor’s (65%) and Independents break for the unions as well – with 45% supporting them over the governors (40%).

Another poll by Faith in Public Life and PPP shows even greater support in Ohio among people of faith.

Q2 Do you think Governor Kasich’s plan to
restrict collective bargaining for Ohio public
employees, such as teachers, firefighters and
police, is the right thing to do or the wrong thing
to do?
Right thing……………………………………………. 32%
Wrong thing………………………………………….. 61%
Not sure ……………………………………………….. 7%

Keep in mind that the petitions are only the first part of the referendum process. The signatures only get the issue on the ballot. It still needs to go in front of all of Ohio’s voters in November. Without support from a majority of Ohio’s voters this bill still has a chance to become law.

And with outside conservative groups planning to pour tons of money into Ohio in support of Kasich’s union busting agenda, we have our work cut out for us.

  • Columbusite

    See you in Cowtown @ the “people’s house” on april 9th!

  • daveinboca

    PPP should not be regarded as a legitimate polling outfit, as Daily Kos uses them for their slanted biased numbers. As a Wisconsinite, the fact that state employee unions still retain the right to negotiate wage contracts makes this all a battle of PR, which the GOP with its habitual lethargy is losing. Fiscal integrity trumps so-called “workers’ rights” ten times out of ten.

  • stryx

    “As a Wisconsinite” seems a little disingenuous, Mr. Boca.

    You voting absentee?

  • Rob

    What polls are legitimate? Only ones that support your ideology?

  • Sluggo

    PPP had a solid record in the 2010 election with an average error of 3.8% behind Quinnipiac, SurveyUSA, and YouGov. Their polls, according to Nate Silver of fivethirtyeight.com, were slightly 0.3% biased in favore of the Rs. Rassmussen had a terrible record of being 5.9% off and a 3.8% GOP bias.

    Read here: http://fivethirtyeight.blogs.nytimes.com/2010/11/04/rasmussen-polls-were-biased-and-inaccurate-quinnipiac-surveyusa-performed-strongly/

  • “And with outside conservative groups planning to pour tons of money into Ohio in support of Kasich’s union busting agenda, we have our work cut out for us.” Yeah that’s the key. Big Business is going to want to protect its investment (John Kasich).

  • Anonymous

    QUESTION FOLKS: Does SB5 go into effect immediately? Some published reports have said yes, but I’ve since heard those reports are wrong. THEN I heard that those reports are correct and some people just THINK they are wrong.

    If they are correct, and SB5 is Ohio law right now, this creates some major problems in, for example, school districts currently negotiating teacher contracts (many are). You can’t negotiate if the very foundation of your employee compensation is now against the law. This will take time to restructure (what a mess) before negotiations could even come close to getting back on track.

    But I was told that this was precisely the reason for Kasich’s making SB5 “immediate.” He wants to stop anymore contacts from being rushed through.

    Hearsay? Can anyone clarify? Hopefully this will be a moot point come November.


  • stryx

    You used a lot of words but the ideas are still wrong.

    I’m not sure why all you who seem to hate American workers always need to avoid blaming management. Did the UAW force the building of the k-car? Whose bright idea was it to go all in on trucks that got 15mpg? Why don’t you blame executives got paid insane amounts regardless of the long-term health of the company?

    “Public sector contracts” are already put to a vote of the public. Everytime there’s an election for council, schoolboard or commisioner, you get to vote your approval of their performance. Or we could do it your way and have an election to decide every contract with every fire department, police department, school district, public hospital, ummm, state park, university, prison…. that wants to sign a contract with a union.

    We already have a good system. The fact that Republicans have managaed to screw most Americans out of good, well paying jobs so that the very richest can have even more money and pay even lower taxes is the real problem. John Kasich thoughtNAFTA would be good for Ohio. All these years later you still want to blame the workers?

  • Anonymous

    I did my own unscientific poll on my street today and Kasich is not popular at all. The people I spoke with are disgusted, and unhappy with Kasich’s arrogant tone. One person said that she could no longer stand to look at his face. We’ve got to all get involved and repeal SB 5.

  • Ohio Firefighter

    We may have our work cut out but that is ok .They have the money, but we have heart and unity and we will not be defeated. Kill SB5

  • jim

    SB5 will become law in 90 days if no referendum is approved. When the referendum gets approved, enactment will occur the day after the general election if it is upheld by the voters. If it is overturned, look for Ka-sick and the rest of the repug bunch to start working on a new bill immediately.

  • Hfshow

    I think it goes like this: bill would be effective immediately. Of course, the public will attempt to make a referendum that would pause the effective date until it appears on a ballot (if possible).

    It affects teachers when the contracts they are currently in expire. Of course, the state could declare your school in “fiscal emergency” (which they’ve made an easy task) in which the bill (regardless of contracts, etc.) would take immediate effect.

  • Ridilead

    This is good news, but you can be sure very big money will be poured into a nasty no-holds-barred public relations campaign demonizing the unions. Remember we’re facing Karl Rove, the Koch brothers, Fox News and the Swift-Boat campaign people. It will be VERY ugly and expensive, and we must be ready for a hard fight. GET READY FRIENDS!! PERSEVERE!

  • stryx

    SB 5 only deals with public employees unions. Crushing the right of all workers to organize will have to be in some other bill.

    It’s ridiculous to try to compare government an private business, as pointed out very well above.

    Why is it that you think the public sector is overpaid? Isn’t the problem really that the Republicans have destroyed the American economy and the only remaining barrier between American wages and Mexican wages is unionized labor?

    Americans work longer and are more productive than almost any other country in the world, yet income growth has been flat for most workers the past 30 years or so. Corporate profits and the income of the very top few percent have grown by mountains. Republicans (e.g. Kasich) thought it would be a good idea if Americans had to compete for wages against developing countries with lax safety, environmental and labor laws.

    So why is it that public employees are the problem? And how is SB 5 supposed to solve any problem? Is the problem that a cop or firefighter make 50k, or is it:

    “According to the latest statistics, CEO pay last year rose by 27 percent, while worker pay rose by just 2 percent.”


    The problem isn’t that some guy with a masters degree makes too much, it that you don’t make enough. And the reason is because the richest portion of our country decided it would be in their interest to make you mad at that guy rather than question why income distribution is so skewed in America.

    The union is your friend.

  • Correct. Except for the new bill part. If the referendum passes in 2011 there is no way in hell the GOP is going to attempt to push through another bill and risk the huge Democratic turnout it might trigger in 2012.

  • Sluggo

    Ohio law doesn’t allow a bill to take effect until 90 days. That’s why we have 90 days to file the signatures. If the signature requirements are met, the law is suspended until after the November election is certified, should it prevail.

  • Anonymous

    Wanna bet? This is their manna. They must bust the unions. They will ram it through again no matter what the political cost.

  • Fotogirlcb2002

    I am a little confused here — you talk of Honda,Toyots etc–
    well theres an example of how you cant compare apples and oranges —
    do you know anyone working for these folks?
    people at Honda make darn good money etc I dont believe the plant near Marysville has unions
    but at this point its not a issue — because of the earthquake in Japan
    the above car plants wont be up and running long– they are running out of parts –Honda at present is trying to run shorter shifts — to keep them from getting unemployment–
    Oh and my reaction to this is — time for the US to start bringing back our own manufacturing– this may be the time to start up those little factories that got sent overseas
    I understand because of shipping businesses over seas we lost like 50,000
    factory type places–
    I do agree with “throw them out ” but honestly there are no simple answeres
    There are always a few employees who will take advantage of everything — but my feelings are the good ones outweigh them
    I will say once more — these people in Ohio and Washington want all of us to work for min wages with no benefits and work until we die
    and SB 5 is just the start in Ohio

  • David from Hilliard

    I would guess if all the people across Ohio who have union connections stopped or significantly reduced their shopping at Wal-Mart, the affect on the company’s sales would probably be significant.

    Wealthy people do not shop Wal-Mart – they may own stock in the company. But shop there? No way.

    It is not Wal-Mart’s stock that drives their success – it’s sales. In fact, if their sales go down, so do there profits – and so does the value of their stock.

  • Real Get Real

    Two bad assumptions assumed here that are common:

    – The profit motive works in every situation. To a fanatical capitalist with a hammer, every issue looks like a nail.

    – The market forces you mention exist in a pure form in the private sector. Hence, the imagined effectiveness of running every public enterprise “at the speed of business” models some imaginary ideal that in reality does not exist anywhere.

    There is no question that “management” still holds unbalanced power in America. The proof is in the static wages of working Americans compared to the burgeoning wealth of a privileged few and the growing gap between the well-off and everyone else. A teacher making $30,000/yr is hardly “overpaid”.

    Throw in globalization, and your pricing of labor gets even tougher. If U.S. workers are deemed too “expensive”, then businesses import cheaper labor with the help of government H1b laws or outsource while still enjoying the protections of the U.S. government here and abroad. Both enrich a few while eroding the Middle Class.

    So how do you price the value of labor in the public sector? You could say that teachers are the true wealth creators and parents subsidize 12-16 years of employee training for future workers while companies like GE pay no taxes. How much is education worth? In that sense, teachers could be correctly considered underpaid.

    Most anti-teacher types simply no longer directly benefit from public schools so they become free-riders or self-interested. It is the classic Tead Party activist collecting Social Security and Medicare while chanting “Less Government” To them, education is simply a line item cost in a budget, not an investment in the future. They also fail to acknowledge that few private companies can claim no benefit from the government in some way. Are these companies also considered “public” if they benefit from roads, public safety, education systems, etc.?

    There are serious issues that Kasich and the GOP are embracing that should cause any American still valuing freedom to cringe. One is that strategy of demonizing a group of Americans (public workers) to make them the “problem” and “enemy” in order to push through a radical ideology. Another is the success of the GOP in turning Middle America against itself even to the point working Americans are voting against their own interests. Finally, the idea of limiting the rights of a class of working Ohioans in order to achieve a political goal is downright scary.

    We can only hope Ohio wakes up at some point and we have a Welch moment:

    “Until this moment, … I think I never gauged your cruelty or recklessness….”

    “Let us not assassinate further …, [Governor!] …. You’ve done enough. Have you no sense of decency, sir, at long last? Have you left no sense of decency?”

  • Modern- have some basic questions regarding the referendum:
    1. What exactly will be on the Nov ballot? Just an issue repealing SB 5? What stops the Gov and the Legislature from passing another version restricting CB in other areas if the voters repeal SB 5? Will a companion referendum be needed to ensure CB rights for public employees on the Nov ballot and could this complicate the repeal campaign?
    2. I can foresee the anti-union forces placing another/other CB issue/issues on the Nov ballot worded to confuse the voters. Has this thought occurred to you too? Any comments?
    3. Is the result of the 1958 “right to work” issue still in effect? Can the legislature nullify the 1958 result through a bill or would a right to work issue have to be passed by the voters in a future referendum to overturn the 1958 result?…Jim, Columbus

  • Guest

    Right on Ohio Firefighter. Thanks for your service.

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